Zabriskie

Puterea ciclistilor in Watti - "baza de date"

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As dori ca in acest topic sa centralizam toate informatiile legate de capacitatile ciclistilor exprimate in watti.

Dupa cateva cautari pe Google am gasit ceva:

"It emerges that my maximum power output is 1,000w, which is about 40 per cent of Chris Hoy's.

Cavendish will generate around 1,600w at the end of a six-hour stage race

....

To win the Olympic gold medal in Athens, for example, I needed to be riding at 570 or 580 watts for four minutes. I'm about 10 or 15 watts better than I was in Athens, which means that if I rode the Olympic pursuit against myself today I would be two seconds faster. That's simply because of the way you progress physically as you get older.

Daniel Coyle quotes Michele Ferrari that shortly before the 2004 Tour, Armstrong was 74 kgs and 493 watts (that's at lactate threshold, which the lab measured at 6.1 liters/minute in 1993).

Ferrari told Coyle the “magic number” for Tour contenders is 6.7 watts per kilogram of body weight.

Armstrong sure can crank. During the final hour of a seven-hour stage of the Tour, he can pedal at an average of 400 watts.

Track racers have pushed it over 2,000 watts for a few seconds.

The average cyclist can barely light a 100-watt lamp. "

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Si acum ma amuz cand imi aduc aminte ce ne certam acum doi ani. Atunci ai postat tu filmuletul facut in sala, pe bicicleta. Spuneai ca ai avut pentru cateva secunde peste 1.000 si eu faceam scandal ca este foarte mult.:((

Ce vremuri domne, ce vremuri.

Google iti arata si informatie relevanta dar te poate indruma si spre informatii eronate.

Aici gasim niste informatii interesante:

Bicycle performance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Eu cred ca nu este relevant cati scoti in maxim. Un culturist va scoate fara probleme un maxim mare. Cand vine vorba de performanta eu cred ca cel mai important este indicatorul watts/kg.

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Asa zic si eu,nu conteaza absolut deloc cat scoti maxim.

Nici nu este loc de comparatie,uite,Cavendish de exemplu ajunge la 1600 timp de cateva secunde cat dureaza sprintul,in timp ce LA poate sa mearga pe munte o ora la 400 si ceva.

W/kg este cea mai buna indicatie de luat in seama.

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Am gasit un post mai vechi :

Iata "anatomia" medaliatului cu argint la Olimpiada din 2008 Gustav Larsson la un contratimp individual de 23 km

SRM power meter

timpul cursei: 30:57

locul ocupat: 3

greutatea corporala: 80kg

viteza medie: approx. 46.77 km/h

nr batai medii ale inimii: 166

nr batai maxim ale inimii: 180

cadenta medie (rotiri pe minut): 91

puterea medie: 486 watts

puterea maxima atinsa: 881 watts

raportul watt/kg 480/80 = 6 w/kg

Eu cred ca nu este relevant cati scoti in maxim. Un culturist va scoate fara probleme un maxim mare.

Nu cred, capacitatea cardiaca a unui pistar sau a unui ciclist tare la sprint este diferita de cea a unui culturist care se antreneaza cu "mia de kg".

Este vorba atat de forta exploziva cat si de un antrenament specific.

Pt ca un culturist sa faca mii de watti trebuie sa se "lanseze"; sa produca 5,6,7,8,900 de watti iar ca sa ajunga la 2000 ar trece o "eternitate" sau vreo 20 secunde minim, timp in care inima sa neantrenata ar renunta f. devreme.

Daca ar fi cum spui tu orice culturist ar bate pe velodrom la 200 metri lansat, proba de 11-12 secunde...

Cand vine vorba de performanta eu cred ca cel mai important este indicatorul watts/kg.

Pe o catarare sunt de acord 100%. Pe plat insa conteaza f. putin acest raport.

Si acum ma amuz cand imi aduc aminte ce ne certam acum doi ani. Atunci ai postat tu filmuletul facut in sala, pe bicicleta. Spuneai ca ai avut pentru cateva secunde peste 1.000 si eu faceam scandal ca este foarte mult.:)

Ce vremuri domne, ce vremuri.

Din greseli se-nvata... sper ! Oricum astept o lada de bere ca sa te iert pt. "daunele psihologice" create :)

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Pt ca un culturist sa faca mii de watti trebuie sa se "lanseze"; sa produca 5,6,7,8,900 de watti iar ca sa ajunga la 2000 ar trece o "eternitate" sau vreo 20 secunde minim, timp in care inima sa neantrenata ar renunta f. devreme.

Daca ar fi cum spui tu orice culturist ar bate pe velodrom la 200 metri lansat, proba de 11-12 secunde...

Unui om care face genoflexiuni cu 300 de kg nu ii ia o eternitate. Din 5 pedale ajunge sa dea peste cap un powermeter:| (sau cel putin asa trebuie sa fie, teoretic).

Sunt de acord cu faptul ca raportul watts/kg este mult mai important pe munte.

Lada de bere o dau atunci cand iesi la plimbare cu Frank, asa cum ies eu cu LeonteX_X

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Nu stiu daca are vreo legatura dar...

Am intalnit oameni de aceiasi greutate cu mine care faceau sala de ceva timp si care impingeau de exemplu la piept aproape dublu fata de mine insa la flotari "intre 2 scaune" eu faceam un numar dublu fata de ei si intr-un timp mult mai scurt.

Nu stiu deci daca puterea bruta este sinonima cu performanta, cat obisnuinta organismului cu un anume tip de efort, obisnuinta care probabil are legaturi puternice cu sistemul nervos central

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@Revolverz

Diferentele prezentate de tine sunt datorate fibrelor musculare.

Tipul care impingea cu haltera mai mult decat tine are mai multe fibre albe, deci o forta mai mare dar o rezistnta mai scazuta.

Tu care faci mai multe flotari ai mai multe fibre rosii, rezistenta mare dar forta mai mica.

@Ovidiu

Ai dreptate cu afirmatiile despre culturisti. Dar un culturist oricat de puternic ar fi nu poate pedala ca un ciclist, in primul rand din cauza ca nu este obisnuit cu acest tip de efort. Am cunoscut si eu oameni pe care nu puteam sa-i inving la skandenberg, dar care in sala erau mult mai slabi decat mine.

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Cred ca e exact invers Luciane, nu? Fibrele rosii sunt responsable de explozie si forta imediata in timp ce fibrele albe sunt de vina cand vorbim de rezistenta.

Culturistul nu are inima unui ciclist si dupa 5 pedale cedeaza. Nu cred ca ar obtine performante mai bune chiar si de scurta durata. E destul de ciudata treaba cu sala. Am prieteni care au fata de mine aproximativ 10-15 kg in plus, merg la sala zilnic si chiar au un corp lucrat, eu la sala nu ridic cat ridica ei, poate pe jumate, dar cand vine vorba de skandenberg nu stam la discutii. Pur si simplu nu imi dau seama cum ridica acele greutati si nu imi pot duce mie mana la un simplu skandenberg, in timp ce un le intorc bratul relativ usor si nu pot ridica totusi cat ridica ei.

Chiar sunt curios cine ar iesi mai castigat dintr'o intrecere culturist vs ciclist cu un powermeter in fata.

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Copy & Paste de pe un site.

Dupa cantitatea de sarcoplasma, mioglobina (hemoglobina musculara), rezerva de oxigen, avem urmatorele tipuri de fibre musculare:

- fibre rosii, cu un continut mai ridicat în mioglobina, cu contractii lente (peste 3,5 ms), puternice, functionând aproape continuu si obosind greu (muschii antigravitationali, cu metabolism preponderent oxidativ);

- fibre albe, cu numeroase miofibrile, mai sarace în mioglobina; au contractii rapide (sub 3,5 ms) si obosesc usor. Au metabolism preponderent glicolitic, anaerob.

Nu exista muschi alcatuit doar din fibre rosii sau albe, dar exista muschi constituiti predominant din fibre rosii sau albe. Astfel, extensorii au în special fibre rosii, iar flexorii mai multe fibre albe.

E destul de logic - fibrele rosii sunt rosii deoarece au un aport mai mare de sange, si implicit de oxigen, ceea ce le ajuta sa functioneze mai mult timp.

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"In George's Hincapie earlier years, when he was less biomechanically efficient, he had to produce 550 watts over the same ten-minute section of pave in order to stay with the leaders."

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De pe blogul https://www.srm.de

"André Greipel: SRM Data of win of stage 4 at Tour of Germany

Andre Greipel was kind enough to give us the SRM file of his stage win in Mainz, when he defeated Robbie McEwen (Silence-Lotto) and Robert Foerster (Team Gerolsteiner).

But let's focus on the last kilometers of the two sprinters:

When we compare their files, we can see that even for the last 10 minutes of the race, the average power of both riders is about the same: Greipel 365 Watts, Foerster 360 Watts with nearly the same average cadence. But a closer look at Greipel's file shows that he peaked at 1,626 Watts 3.5 minutes before the finish, probably to get into a perfect position.

Closer to the finish, for instance in the last three minutes of the race, there are some differences to see: the average powers of Greipel and Foerster show significant differences - Greipel 537 Watts, Foerster 508 Watts.

The last minute, the last kilometer. Greipel is right on the wheel of Ciolek, Ciolek right behind Tony Martin - this is the Team Columbia lead out. It's smoother for Greipel than for Foerster. You can see that when you compare the average cadence 89.6 rpm for Foerster and 104.9 rpm for Greipel. Greipel with an average power of 713 Watts, Foerster with 659 Watts.

In the last 30 seconds, Ciolek launches the sprint for Greipel who leaves a gap of about one meter. On his wheel is McEwen and right behind is Foerster. Two high efforts for both until Greipel's explosive move from Ciolek's wheel. Greipel's effort: 1,436 Watts, then 1,215 Watts and for the final sprint 8 seconds before the finish 1,533 Watts. Foerster was not able to pass Greipel or McEwen. His effort was 1,337 Watts, then 1,099 Watts and finally 1,183 Watts. Greipel was always pedaling, his average power for the last 30 seconds an amazing 1061 Watts, cadence 102.9 rpm (max cadence 112 rpm). Foerster didn't pedal 30 seconds before the finish, he had to start again, and therefore his average cadence was 91.9 rpm and the average power 908 Watts."

______________________________________________________________________

Greg Henderson's Paris-Roubaix SRM data

The overall average for the race: 286 watts (3.9 W/kg), cadence 76 rpm, 38.7 km/h.

His maximum power values for this race are:

1 second 1,226 Watt (16.6 W/kg)

1 minute: 585 Watts (7.9 W/kg)

4 minutes: 446 Watts (6.0 W/kg)

20 minutes: 371 Watts (5.0 W/kg)

For the first two hours of the race, he rode with an average of 330 Watts (4.5 W/kg) and an average speed of 45 km/h, which must have been superhard. His smoothed power curve went down constantly, and in the last hour the average power was just 240 Watts (3.2 W/kg). But after nearly 6.5 hours of racing

________________________________________________________________________

The SRM data of Johannes Froehlinger (Team Milram) and Brian Vandborg (Team Liquigas) show that the race started at the Champs-Elysees.

And even then, only the last two laps of 6.5 kilometers were ridden with higher intensity. Most of the time they were doing more than eight minutes a lap, and then it accelerated in the last lap to about 7 ½ minutes and an average speed of 52 km/h.

Both riders worked hard in the last lap to help their sprinters get into the best possible position for the sprint. Froehlinger's average power was 298 watts (4.8 w/kg), Vandborg's was 397 watts (5.5 w/kg).

Johannes Fröhlinger

Max. power

2 sec 881 W

10 sec 704 W

20 sec 627 W

1 min 441 W

4 min 385 W

20 min 327 W

60 min 266 W

Brian Vandborg

2 sec - 1.072 W

10 sec -838 W

20 sec -754 W

1 min - 549 W

4 min - 463 W

20 min - 415 W

60 min - 381 W

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"Cancellara averaged 629 watts on his 3:51 prologue to open up the Tour of California Sunday!"

"The commentators were saying that on the CSC training camp he was doing around 560w for 4-6min intervals, but was looking for 600w."

Name: Fabian Cancellara

Country: Switzerland

Born: 18.03.1981

Height: 186cm

Weight: 80kg

Pro since: 2001

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Damiano Cunego: "Ha 420 watt alla soglia con un rapporto peso/potenza superiore a 7, ottimo. La capacità di trasportare l' ossigeno in periferia è ottima con un VO2 di 80 ml/min/chilo. Ha una capacità polmonare di 6 litri. La frequenza a riposo è di 43-44 battiti al minuto, con 180 alla soglia e una punta massima di 200. La massa grassa è del 5%. Cunego ha incominciato il Giro a 60 chili e lo ha finito a 58 scarsi. Cunego ha soprattutto qualità genetiche assolutamente favorevoli: valori elevati di ematocrito e emoglobina. «Ha ricevuto dall' UCI l' «attestazione di ematocrito naturalmente elevato»: 52% di ematocrito, 18 di emoglobina"

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http://www.bikecult.com/bikecultbook/sports_recordsHour.html

Chris BOARDMAN, 445 watts, 0.165 cd, 170 mm cranks, 56.375 kph

Tony ROMINGER, 468 watts, 0.20 cd, 172.5 mm cranks, 55.291 kph

Miguel INDURAIN, 477 watts, 0.235 cd, 190 mm cranks, 53.040 kph

Graeme OBREE, 400 watts, 0.18 cd, 175 mm cranks, 52.713 kph

Eddy MERCKX, 485 watts, 0.75 cd, 175 mm cranks, 49.431 kph

____________________________________________________________

Gustav Larsson's (Tour of California) Prologue Summary Data:

http://home.trainingpeaks.com/races/2009-tour-of-california-race-file-analysis/prologue.aspx

Time: 4:45

Distance: 3.87 km (2.40 mi)

Average watts: 529w (1066 w max)

Body Weight: 80kg (176 lbs)

Average heart rate: 166 bpm

Max heart rate: 175 bpm

Average speed: 48.1 kph (29.9 mph)

Max speed: 57.3 kph (35.6 mph)

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485 merckx >-)

sunt curios cat de corect e calculat...pentru ca in 1972 cand a doborat el recordul orei nu prea erau srm-uri si nici polar-uri >:))<

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Toate conditiile (fara vant, perfect plat, medie, tip bicla, greutate, pozitie ciclist, etc) in care a fost facut recordul permit calculul teoretic :D

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scria acolo ca a folosit o bicicleta de 5,7 kg :D cred ca e cea mai usoara bicicleta de acolo din lista....oare in cazul asta nu l-ar fi avantajat o bicicleta ceva mai grea?

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Un mic off-topic:ati vazut ce scrie la Jacques Anquetils la motivul pentru care nu i-a fost omologat recordul ?! Ca a refuzat controlul medical. Cred ca s-a simtit jignit si de aia a refuzat :D

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